clutch bell shimming

[wedoitall]

got me some team fasteddy shims for the clutch bell. should i shim on the bell side or the pinion side? also should there i shim so there is still alil bit of play or no play at all?

[Vertigo Performance]

A bit of play is a must otherwise the bearings will bind.
Shim on the bell side.

.1 - .2mm play is ok

[wedoitall]

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

A bit of play is a must otherwise the bearings will bind.
Shim on the bell side.

.1 - .2mm play is ok

yea i put too much shim in and the bell or pinion didnt wanna spin by hand. so i just let one shim in but i put it on the pinion side oops. ill have to take the new alum. support bracket back off and switch it to the bell side. thanks for the reply

[Vertigo Performance]

Oops!!!
I hope you haven't moved the shim yet, I meant to write shim on the pinion side!
It really doesn't matter but shimming on the pinion side is more convenient.

[FastEddy]

I usually look for an alignment issue before I decide to put one on the front or the back.

[Vertigo Performance]

Well then Eddy you are putting too much effort into a negligible amount.

[wedoitall]

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

Oops!!!
I hope you haven't moved the shim yet, I meant to write shim on the pinion side!
It really doesn't matter but shimming on the pinion side is more convenient.

ha! na i didnt move it, was gonna but got called out to work.

Originally Posted by FastEddy

I usually look for an alignment issue before I decide to put one on the front or the back.

yea i already did that why i kept it on the pinion side....go idea tho.

[FastEddy]

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

Well then Eddy you are putting too much effort into a negligible amount.

Im going to go out on a limb here and say:
Thats the difference between the way you and I think.
For me its all the little things that make a difference.

[Vertigo Performance]

The average thickness of a human hair is .1mm
There is nothing on this truck that has a tolerance that tight..

[FastEddy]

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

The average thickness of a human hair is .1mm
There is nothing on this truck that has a tolerance that tight..

Yes, but I have seen stock bells in stock holders that have up to 2mm of play in the shafts from front to back. This is the reason we make shim kits. If you watch my video on how to properly shim your bell you will be able to see this issue in vivid color.

If people "shim out of ease" instead of looking for alignment and doing it properly, the pinion will hang off the front of the spur and not be making contact with the back. It continues to be a HUGE issue on the Baja as it has been from day one. If they are not properly aligned, it will eat the shit out of the spur in no time at all.

Placing the proper thickness of shims in the proper places front and back will keep everything in perfect alignment and make for a happy RD driver.

If something is worth doing, its worth doing right. The smallest of details are the ones that mater the most.

[Vertigo Performance]

I don't need to watch a video LOL!! I have been shimming bells for almost 30 years..

A human hair, not 2mm but a human hair.. The minute the truck is set on uneven ground .1mm is no longer .1mm and once the truck starts moving as in the case of the Losi the spur gear moves as much as 4mm
Shims may be important in reducing play at the bearings but to suggest .1mm is an important detail at the spur gear is absurd, geez the wobble in a spur gear is greater than that...

Wedoitall, It really doesn't matter where the shims go when it comes to .1mm but putting them next to the bell instead of the pinion just means more work for you when making adjustments..

[Vertigo Performance]

I have never had to shim the pinions for the purpose of gear alignment, the spur gear on the baja as far more wobble than that.. I can't even imagine worrying about it. Rotate the gear 2 degrees and the alignment is out again.

[FastEddy]

I just dont understand your point......
The point here is how to properly shim the pinion on a Baja.

Use the proper amount of shims on the front, back, or both to take the play out.
Shim it to allow about .2-.3 of play. Use as many shims as needed.

Take note that the pinion is as centered on the spur as possible by using the shims on the front or the back as needed.

[badger]

Are you guys done with the pissing match yet?

[FastEddy]

Originally Posted by wedoitall

got me some team fasteddy shims for the clutch bell. should i shim on the bell side or the pinion side? also should there i shim so there is still alil bit of play or no play at all?

Great questions to ask.
Every single Baja has this issue. Some have MUCH more play then others

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

A bit of play is a must otherwise the bearings will bind.

Perfect!

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

Shim on the bell side.

Only half the right answer depending on the alignment of the pinion to the spur after the play is removed.

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

.1 - .2mm play is ok

Perfect.

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

Oops!!!
I hope you haven't moved the shim yet, I meant to write shim on the pinion side! It really doesn't matter but shimming on the pinion side is more convenient.

Half the right answer. Yes its easier. But in many cases its not the right way to do it.

Originally Posted by FastEddy

I usually look for an alignment issue before I decide to put one on the front or the back.

This is how you look to see where you want to place the shims or how you want to distribute the shims.

Originally Posted by vertigo performance

Well then Eddy you are putting too much effort into a negligible amount.

Many setups require up to 2mm of shims. This is not a negligible amount. Putting them all on the front in most cases will miss-align the pinion to the spurr.

Originally Posted by Vertigo Performance

I have never had to shim the pinions for the purpose of gear alignment,

You must have gotten one of the good ones out there. Its more common then not to have to use shims as an alignment aid on the pinion. Having sold as many shim kits as I have over the last 5 years I have had many tech support calls, e-mails, and requests. Ill be conservative and say 200-250 of them. I think I may have good knowledge on this subject to share.

Originally Posted by badger

Are you guys done with the pissing match yet?

No pissing contest here. If you want to call trying to get the MOST DETAILED & PROPER Tech answers out to people so they can get the most out of my products, other peoples products and have a better RC experience pissing, then no. Ill be pissing all day long. People deserve the BEST COLLECTIVE ANSWERS. I will add to or correct a "Half answer" every time I see one.

If someone wants to minimize or belittle me about the amount of detail I try to pass on, thats their issue.


9 Min. Mark covers shimming pinion and spur.

HPI Baja 5SC SS Build Video #35 Page 48-49 - YouTube

HPI Baja 5SC SS Build Video #35 Page 48-49 - YouTube

[wedoitall]

awesome, the video was fantastic. thanks brutha

[arthurdaley]

Originally Posted by FastEddy

Yes, but I have seen stock bells in stock holders that have up to 2mm of play in the shafts from front to back. This is the reason we make shim kits. If you watch my video on how to properly shim your bell you will be able to see this issue in vivid color.

If people "shim out of ease" instead of looking for alignment and doing it properly, the pinion will hang off the front of the spur and not be making contact with the back. It continues to be a HUGE issue on the Baja as it has been from day one. If they are not properly aligned, it will eat the shit out of the spur in no time at all.

Placing the proper thickness of shims in the proper places front and back will keep everything in perfect alignment and make for a happy RD driver.

If something is worth doing, its worth doing right. The smallest of details are the ones that mater the most.

Well I am a bit fussy, as I pulled down my Losi to nut's and bolts the day I got it, and after dealing with all issues I found left by the manufacturer, I then went through the whole truck tweaking and shimming as much as was possible without waiting for the aftermarket guy's to bring out certain part's, I now have it as near to perfect as is possible but will need the clutch bell shim's when I fit the new bell, housing, and clutch bell carrier, along with refitting the 18T pinion.
With the Turtle alloy braces Losi top front brace, braced thr/brake servo the truck feels pretty tight almost like I am in it.

[arthurdaley]

Originally Posted by FastEddy

Great questions to ask.
Every single Baja has this issue. Some have MUCH more play then others


Perfect!


Only half the right answer depending on the alignment of the pinion to the spur after the play is removed.


Perfect.

Half the right answer. Yes its easier. But in many cases its not the right way to do it.


This is how you look to see where you want to place the shims or how you want to distribute the shims.


Many setups require up to 2mm of shims. This is not a negligible amount. Putting them all on the front in most cases will miss-align the pinion to the spurr.


You must have gotten one of the good ones out there. Its more common then not to have to use shims as an alignment aid on the pinion. Having sold as many shim kits as I have over the last 5 years I have had many tech support calls, e-mails, and requests. Ill be conservative and say 200-250 of them. I think I may have good knowledge on this subject to share.



No pissing contest here. If you want to call trying to get the MOST DETAILED & PROPER Tech answers out to people so they can get the most out of my products, other peoples products and have a better RC experience pissing, then no. Ill be pissing all day long. People deserve the BEST COLLECTIVE ANSWERS. I will add to or correct a "Half answer" every time I see one.

If someone wants to minimize or belittle me about the amount of detail I try to pass on, thats their issue.


9 Min. Mark covers shimming pinion and spur.

HPI Baja 5SC SS Build Video #35 Page 48-49 - YouTube

Well I am going to put my two penneth in, I strip all my RTR vehicles down to nuts and bolts, and put a lot of time and effort to adding shim's as and where needed, also make a bit of play if something is a bit tight, on all rebuild's, I regard the RTR's as a Kit, I keep all manner of washer's and spacer's I buy the most used in bulk, and have had to flat a few down with fine wet & dry to get it just so.
I have found doing this I have far less failures and breakages than my fellow basher's and racer's, but I am as tough on my truck's and buggies, if not more so as I know it will last longer.